1973 Custom Cruiser

David

 

Thanks.

Now that it's out of the car, I'm getting the front seat reupholstered, and I'm ordering new carpet. It's much easier to get at things under the dash as well as the front-to-back wiring with the seats and carpet removed, and I'd really like to fix this problem before the new carpet arrives and the seat is done so I can reinstall both when I get them.

 

Glad you likes it!

 

Jaunty, I bet that front seat was a bear to get out of your wagon.

The only way I could get mine out was to remove the center pillar!





David

 

David, do I detect a certain EXTREME HOW TO coming on?

Next thing I know you'll be jacking up the horn to get a new car under it!

 

Actually, it was no trouble at all. I racked the seat fully forward and removed the four rear bolts (two each side), then moved the seat all the way back to get at the four front bolts. Then, with my wife helping me, we lifted the seat and maneuvered it out the passenger side door, tilting it where necessary to get it through. Avoids the steering wheel going this way.

I wonder if the seat couldn't be gotten out through the rear tailgate if it wouldn't fit through any of the doors.

Here's a couple of photos with everything out. Looks like I need to spray a little rust stabilizer in the front footwell area. Suggestions?

 

I've done more wiring checking and thinking. First, I have solid wiring all the way from the dash switch to the tailgate motor. There is just no power to the dash switch. I confirmed that today with an ohmmeter by disconnecting the power connector at the motor and grounding, in turn, each of the two leads while also grounding the leads at the switch end. Good continuity all around.

Then I got to thinking more about that accessory block connector and what goes through that 40 amp breaker. As I've said, it controls several things that a car might or might not have, including power seat, power windows (including, apparently, the rear window on a Custom Cruiser), convertible top, power locks, and the tailgate. My car has power seats and, of course, the two power rear window and tailgate.

I noticed long ago that there are two leads coming off of the accessory block as I showed in my earlier photo. I've always assumed that one of them is for the power seats and the other for the tailgate. But I'd forgotten about the power window. For some reason I had gotten it in my head that, since this car does not have power windows in the doors, there wouldn't be a connection for them at the accessory block, and I had not thought that that rear window could get its power from this as well.

So now I'm thinking that there should be THREE leads coming off the accessory block, and I have only two. The two leads I have are for the power rear window and the power seat, the latter of which I confirmed with a voltmeter. Given the accident history with this car and the presence of some aftermarket rewiring, anything is possible. When the car was repaired at the body shop, perhaps they failed completely to wire up the tailgate power lead to the dash switch. So now I'm finding myself more than ever liking my idea of just running my own wire from one of the unoccupied terminals on the accessory block (there are three unused ones) to the dash switch.


By the way, I removed that relay-looking thing next to the accessory block and tried to play with it. I figured that putting 12 volts to one of the three terminals (probably the one that's by itself) with the other lead to the mounting bracket to complete the circuit would cause the other two terminals to be connected. But nothing happened no matter what I did, and none of the terminals is electrically connected to either of the others. I don't know if I'm just not testing it correctly or if it's gone bad. It certainly looks to be 37 years old, and it could have died during that time, especially if it ever got wet. I have no idea what this is, what it's called, or where I would buy a replacement if I could. There are no markings on it the metal body. The only markings of any kind are the words HI-RAM on the black plastic base. I could take it with me to an auto parts store and see what happens. Might be kind of fun.

 

When all else fails, read the directions. Words to live by.


I started going through the Fisher Body manual in a more serious way, and I learned some things. First off, the tailgate dash switch operation isn't controlled by the transmission setting quite like I thought, and how it works depends on the make. For Chevies, the tailgate dash switch only works if the ignition is On and the transmission is in Park or Neutral. For Pontiacs and Buicks, the ignition must be On and the transmission in Park (no mention of Neutral). For Olds, it's the simplest, but a little weirder. The ignition must be ON but with the engine OFF. No mention of the transmission, so there's apparently no sensor like the neutral safety switch involved, which makes the wiring a little easier.

Second, that relay-looking thing right next to the accessory block apparently really is a relay and it apparently really is involved with the tailgate motor. It also looks to be correctly wired. It's apparently the relay that has to close when the ignition is in the "on" position in order for the dash switch to work. It's actually labeled "ignition relay" in the wiring diagram, and it's wired into the tailgate motor circuit. I suspect it doesn't work as I don't hear any clicking from it when I put the ignition on, so I took it out and went to a local Carquest store hoping they could match it. They did come up with a match, and it has to be ordered "from the factory" as he put it, which is in Illinois (nice to see that it's not in China!). It's going to cost me $40, but it will be here Thursday afternoon, and I think it's money well spent. My luck wouldn't be that good that replacing this would be all it takes to get the tailgate working, but we can hope. Also, I wonder how the relay knows that the ignition is on but the engine is not running. The wiring to it doesn't look complicated enough for that!

Third, and as jeffreyalman has asked about, according to the wiring diagram, the operation of the tailgate from the rear key switch should be independent of what's going on up front. In fact, the power lead for the rear tailgate switch is the SAME wire (almost) as the power lead for the rear window, and, as I've said, the window does work. But the wiring diagram actually shows that the power wire splits at some point as it's going to the back of the car (it might be right at the switch for all I know), and there are thus actually TWO power leads connected to the key switch, one for the window and the other for the tailgate.

So now I've got to look more closely at the rear wiring to see if I can find a problem. One thing the manual suggests is what I was thinking about doing, and that is, to test the motor on the car, which I should do, one should hook a wire from the accessory block directly to one of the two leads at the dash switch going back to the motor and see if the motor actually moves. As I said earlier, I took the motor out and tested it with a 12 V power supply weeks ago, and it did move. But I've never tested it actually in the car, and I should do that to make sure there aren't some weird grounding issues or the like on top of everything else.

You know, I would be perfectly happy if one or the other, dash switch or key switch, would work. I just want to be able to open and close the tailgate more or less the way the designers intended. It seems like it ought to be possible to get one of these two methods to work!


Also, I ordered the new carpet yesterday. Should be here Friday or Monday. I'm taking the front seat and the lower cushion from the 1/3 second seat for reupholstering on Thursday.


Just keep opening the wallet!

 

On the Ford EVTM, they show where the splices occur in the wiring diagrams.

C = connector
S = splice

etc.

So S101 or S458 would be splices. Yours should have something similar which might point you to the joint/split on the tailgate/window adventure.

So I guess the Clambake is off, eh?

 

sounds like great progress! And contrary to what the manual says for Oldsmobile, mine (tailgate) works from the dash in P with engine on. I have not tried N but I also now have a half fried tailgate switch thanks to my own personal tailgate saga.

But naysayers scoff if you must, we are still the proud owners of the answer to the question that absolutely nobody asked.

 

Unfortunately, the manual is not this detailed. There is no labeling at the point where wires appear to split.

Yes, no clambake today!

 

it may be in the body manual

 

Even the cheapy Haynes and Chilton manuals show the approximate locations in the wiring diags.

 

Jaunty, I would check out the POR-15 site, or go to your local auto color store, and get some Marine Clean, Metal Ready and some POR-15 paint.

Clean the floorboards with the Marine Clean, then spray the Metal Ready on the rust and let it sit for a bit, and then wash it off with water. Dry the area, and then put a light coat of the POR-15 on the rust, and let it sit overnight. Then coat it again in the morning.

Check the underside to see if it is rusty, and coat that the same way.

If you have never used POR-15 before, know that you have to be very careful to keep it off your skin, because once it dries, it is permanent! Only goes away when your skin cells exfoliate.

David

 

It's the body manual I've been looking at. The chassis manual has only a basic wiring diagram which doesn't show anything after the accessory block. The body manual has individual diagrams for the various power options coming off the accessory block (seats, sunroof, windows, door locks, tailgate, convertible top, etc.) that might or might not be on your particular car. The body manual DOES show which of these options has an ignition relay interlock. That's what the pink wire side of the accessory block is that I was wondering about earlier. The pink wire comes from the ignition coil, so that's how anything that needs for the ignition to be on to work knows that the ignition is on.

I REALLY have my fingers crossed that this new relay I'm getting will fix the front end wiring issue.