What have you done to your wagon lately? (Let's keep the thread going!)

Discussion in 'General Station Wagon Discussions' started by Dogbone, Jul 25, 2011.

  1. Silvertwinkiehobo

    Silvertwinkiehobo "Everything that breaks starts with 'F.'"

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    Good show! I hope it all works out to your wallet's satisfaction.
     
  2. Silvertwinkiehobo

    Silvertwinkiehobo "Everything that breaks starts with 'F.'"

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    And I bet the b*stard cracked like a gunshot.
     
  3. Poison_Ivy

    Poison_Ivy Dogzilla Fan

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    I don't know. I was sitting indoors, waiting for someone to ask for the keys. Instead, he came up with the breaker bar, telling me it got done. The door was open and I didn't hear a thing.
    I managed to get a couple photos, with the sun glaring directly at me. Being blinded, I tried my best at guessing where it was pointed. I'll get better shots, tomorrow. There aren't triangular control arms, on this vehicle. Instead, they use some sort of light alloyed individual arms. Each having its own balljoint connecting them to the spindle. In the first image, the arrow is pointing to a bolt holding that joint, by clamping the spindle end, while securing the balljoint stem, crossing a groove.
    In the second photo, a longer bolt secures two balljoints, simultaneously, also holding them in at their grooves for extra measure A6_Schwenk.jpg A6_Schwenk_2.jpg
     
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  4. Silvertwinkiehobo

    Silvertwinkiehobo "Everything that breaks starts with 'F.'"

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    Yeah, I think the 'Doctors of Engineering' at Audi had too much time on their hands and too much access to R&D money. The biggest thing I don't like about modern cars is the fact that nothing is serviceable except by replacement. And on the Audis, nothing is cheap.
     
  5. Poison_Ivy

    Poison_Ivy Dogzilla Fan

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    This one will get cheap, as soon as it's gone
    This car's been hanging on my wallet. If I get a thousand for it, I would almost break even. A fresh inspection is worth another thousand. If I don't get two grand, I'll see about parking it somewhere, until I either get it or sell it for parts. The engine alone is worth at least a grand, considering it has unusually low milage, for one of these. I could easilly off both headlights at 75€ each and the Hi-Fi with Bose speakers would look nice in my three-wheeler.
    I had to run to town, yesterday. But, managed to get a start. This is how far I got, yesterday evening. In the 1st image, one of the lower balljoint nuts was removed conventionally.
    In the 2nd image, so was the other one which was mounted in the opposite direction.
    In the 3rd, this is the bolt securing both upper balljoints

    A6_B_Joint.jpg A6_B_Joint_2.jpg A6_B_Joint_3.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2018
  6. kevdupuis

    kevdupuis Membrane

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    Reminds me of the Mercedes suspension engineering that went into the Chrysler LX platform, complex, expensive and needs replacing every 6 years. At least my W123 & W126 cars have cruder but long lived components.
     
  7. Poison_Ivy

    Poison_Ivy Dogzilla Fan

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    I'll have to Google or DuckDuck those up. I think, the W123 was the old Mercedes 190 which had the first non-traditional suspension type of which resembled struts combined with control arms. I've still got my old Chilton manual, featuring those. Will have to look it up.
    I ran into a snag, yesterday. Both of those bolts holding the upper balljoints and tierod are rusted in. If I go out and rent a torch, I could drive out the bolt holding the tierod, without damaging its end. That's sadly not the case with the balljoints, though. It looks like the joints are part of the control arms. They go and forge these parts from some light alloy, to save on sprung weight, simultaneously hanging heavy brake rotors and calipers outboard which doesen't make sense and defeats their purpose. If they're going to that amount of trouble, why not mount the brakes inboard, like they did on the 100 LS?
    If these suspensions weren't assembled automated, either someone didn't bother using copper paste or an inexpensive type anti-seize compound or Audi didn't require them to use any. If the joints were baggy, it would at least make some sense to not bother assembling these suspensions dry. But, in this case, this is a senseless waste of perfectly good parts, just to replace a CV-joint boot. That's the turning point. I'd rather sell the car with a glued-together boot or a damaged one, than to go change even more parts unneccesarily. I don't know how much punishment these glue it boots can take. But, if they'll guarantee to last a short while, at least, that'll have to be good enough. The 3rd option would be to soak that longer bolt with rust inhibitor and wait until it'll loosen up. I've never had any luck doing it that way and really don't want to gamble another couple weeks with it, risking it not loosening up.
    I've still got my Hazet Ball joint and tierod end popper. Up until now, there wasn't a joint this thing couldn't pop, except for the lower joints on this wagon. They are just to broad and it looks like a special popper or pickle fork is required. Pickle forks aren't that good for the joints, since a boot can get ripped and excessive pressure is put on the plastic joint friction surfaces. I left my pickle fork at my ex-wife's parent's house some 28 years or so ago and it was long gone, when I went to get it 21 years ago. But, I'm not confident that the knuckle will clear, as long as the uppers are still connected.
    As pictured, the tierod end is just hanging there, waiting to drop. The ABS sensor is just hanging there, because I'm not sure that the board computer will recognise it, if the circuit gets broken.
    In the last image, one can see how grease from the torn boot was slung all over the wheel well. As soon as I get it off, I'll take a close look at it, to see if some weasel owes me a set of gloves. Weasels like chewing on anything made of rubber, if a rival weasel invades its territory leaving traces of it having been there.
    One thing for sure. Anybody who does any work of their own, on one of these, is either nuts or a masochist, when he goes out and buys another one. I suppose, most owners are MAK types who simply take theirs into the dealer and just pay what they get charged, without letting themselves get bothered with details. The older Audi 100 LSs should have given future owners a clue. Then again, when VW began sharing components, the Audi Fox, 100 and 200 were still okay

    A6_Weg_3.jpg A6_Weg.jpg A6_Weg_2.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
  8. Grizz

    Grizz Are we there yet???

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    I had luck with an impact hammer and just shooting around the joints when ever I encounter one that’s stuck. That’s a weird set up for sure. Weird and rather large spindle too. Wonder why??? Glue that thing and then enforce it with a few all mighty zip ties
     
  9. Poison_Ivy

    Poison_Ivy Dogzilla Fan

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    It's hollow and also appears to be cast from some light alloy. I think it's simpy long for clearing the wheel.
    Ideally, slipping a baloon or condom over the old boot would be a great temporary fix, if I could just slip one over. I was at the same auto parts store, today, where I inquired about a replacement boot a couple weeks ago. I got a different clerk who I think was substituting one of the usual clerks who might be on Summer vacation. He said, those glue together boots were no longer available. I told him that they had them here, a couple weeks ago. No budge. Their databank is set up to where things aren't easy to find. The usual clerks will take time looking. This new guy seemed not to feel like digging too deep. So, I'll show back up on Monday. If the normal clerk is there, I'll try again. If not, they're easilly available in the internet, despite my dislike towards ordering parts on-line
     
  10. kevdupuis

    kevdupuis Membrane

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    Just wondering, did you jack up the lower control arm to unload the spring pressure on the ball joints when you tried to pull the upper bolt.
    I only mentioned simply because sometimers hits all of us. (Some times I forget). :oops:

    Yeah the upper and lower arms are aluminium alloy.
     
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  11. Silvertwinkiehobo

    Silvertwinkiehobo "Everything that breaks starts with 'F.'"

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    You should be applying penetrating oil on those bolts before attempting to break them loose, then when you do take your BFH (Big Freaking Hammer) and smack the body of the knuckle where the bolts are threaded through. The penetrating oil is supposed to soak in, and the hammer helps relieve the stress between the metals. Also apply it to the ball studs, as removing the bolts will make the studs slip out--they're not tapered, nor are they 'pulled' into the metal of the knuckle.
     
  12. Poison_Ivy

    Poison_Ivy Dogzilla Fan

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    I did spray oil on both bolts, a couple days ago and really should go out and spray some more. As far as the lower ball joints are concerned, there is a standard adjustable puller which could pop the one facing forward. If the five pound hammer can't loosen that rear one pointing up, there's no point in going after the front one. Will go and try, later on. All ball studs on this are tapered. But, that's no big deal. It's hard to see. But, there are slits on the knucle where it meets the joints. That tierod popped out immediately, as soon as I hammered a chisel into its slit
    Yeah, I did. I photograhed everything with all tools out of the way, though. I always have at least two devices holding up the vehicle. I'm almost sure, though, that that strut holds everything from falling
     
  13. Poison_Ivy

    Poison_Ivy Dogzilla Fan

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    I often heard that penetrating oil works. I was always torch happy. Therefore, have never given the stuff a chance, until my torch was too far away to use. Thanks for the tip I previously ignored. I didn't think that that long bolt would budge, until it did, yesterday. Now, it turns. Not freely, yet. But, enought to where it'll come out, when the hammer and drift gets applied.
    To pop both lower joints, I had to borrow the rack from my drill press, as a counterweight for the 5 pound hammer. With all that now out of the way, I'll soak the last bolt holding the tierod in place, today. Then, jump on it tomorrow. In a worst case scenario, I'll have to see about renting a torch.
    Now, I know why that shop owner didn't want money for loosening that bolt. He thought I couldn't pull it off. In fact, it didn't look possible, without disconnecting every joint, because they leave you just enough room for removing the entire knuckle, as required, only by swinging it out of the way, to remove it from the last joint which is that front-facing lower one. Had the axle shaft end been any longer, there would have been no way of removing and installing one, because of that one ball joint

    A6_Craftsman.jpg
     
  14. Poison_Ivy

    Poison_Ivy Dogzilla Fan

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    Getting the knuckle off, at this point, was a piece of cake. The only obstacle, now, is popping the joint from the axle. There's a sort of snapring holding it in place. There are adjustable pullers for these axles or one could slide a drift into where that 17 mm allen bolt belongs and then screw in that bolt, until enough pressure is applied for getting the internally machined ridge to overcome the ring.
    I got pictures of that barn find '69 Renault 16 sent to me. They're not that thrilling. But, there is still some charm to be seen. He says, it has over 200,000 kilometers. 160,00 roughly equates to 100,000 miles. That doesen't necessarily mean the engine's trashed, if maintained somewhat properly. I'd have to see the undercarriage. If it's salvagable, I'll make him an offer. He says, it's not just about pouring gasoline into the tank and then driving it away. But, what does he know. It supposedly had no more than three previous owners and has been sitting for ten years.
    Being a base model, I'll have to see what's available for TXing it. If the rockers aren't perforated, it'll pass inspection, despite the door skin and any rust through on the rear wheelwell. The rear bumper looks pretty bad. But, it's still real and not some modern scam.
    I just noticed that only two pedals are to be seen. The brake pedal isn't typical of an American one mounted for automatic transmissions and there is what looks like a selection indicator, just above the steering column, on the instrument panel:

    A6_Knuck.jpg A6_Knuck_2.jpg R_16_3.jpg
    R_16.jpg R_16.jpg_2.jpg R_16_4.jpg R_16_5.jpg R_16_6.jpg R_16_8.jpg R_16_9.jpg R_16_91.jpg




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    Last edited: Jun 25, 2018
  15. OldFox

    OldFox Curmudgeon

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    Congratulations on taking almost 2 weeks doing a job that a regular mechanic is required to do in a couple of hours.
     

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