I've made the leap from wagon lurker to wagon owner

Discussion in 'General Station Wagon Discussions' started by Cyber-Wizard, Nov 10, 2010.

  1. Cyber-Wizard

    Cyber-Wizard Well-Known Member

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    This one's just got that "hold but button down long enough and the window continues without you". Sure would be sweet if it had that Lincoln feature. Hmmm....perhaps something to build later. I remember being pretty envious of the slowly dimming interior lights in my business partner's dynasty years ago. I wound up strapping together a mess of capacitors and tying them to the door switch circuit so my Reliant wagon would do the same. So many of those cool features are staggeringly simple from an electronic standpoint. Dunno why the cost so much to add when you're at the dealer's desk.
     
  2. Stormin' Norman

    Stormin' Norman Well-Known Member

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    So you tinker with circuits, eh? You're gonna love this site:

    I don't know if it's an Australia-only or US/Aussie site, because you can also find the US site, I have a separate Favourites category just for their articles. Airdam design mods, workshop planning and tips, all for the automotive hobbyist.

    US site, but not as complete as the Aussie site
    http://www.autospeed.com/

    Here's a few examples from the Aussie site (.au):

    Multicoloured Instrument LED circuit:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/A_111386/cms/article.html

    DIY Workshop, Part 1:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/A_109196/article.html

    Part 2:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/A_109197/article.html

    Then if you search, you'll find a 7 part series on the Ultimate DIY Automotive Toolkit:

    Part 1:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/A_111109/article.html

    .
    .
    .
    .
    Part 7:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/A_111152/article.html

    They also have summary pages, using the lefthand menus, that give you an Index of topics:

    So DIY Tech Features has 559 articles like those above:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/S_10/cms/section.html

    Tech Features has all kinds of article comparing automotive engineering and some that you can build testers for and tweak on your cars:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/S_3/cms/section.html

    ETC., ETC.

    Way at the top, you'll see other 'magazines' they have online, like this one, that are also DIY formats:
    http://www.siliconchip.com.au/

    Have fun. I spent hours cruising the Autospeed site, and kept going "WOW!" HOLY CRAP! :thumbs2:

    I like the DIY Airdam articles a lot, if only for the simple ways they show to reduce airtraps at the front and rear of any car:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/A_2455/article.html

    http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/A_2456/article.html

    12-volt Bench supply DIY:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/A_111380/cms/article.html

    Lowered Springs:
    http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/A_111167/article.html

    Just try any keywords that come to mind in their SEARCH box, and watch... It's kind of like having XMAS every minute.:biglaugh::D
     
  3. Cyber-Wizard

    Cyber-Wizard Well-Known Member

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    I had a pretty busy week at work so I didn't get any time outside. The garage is too small to work in and it's been too dark/cold to work out there for any amount of time after work.

    I think I'm going to take off the drivers door panel today and really go over that wiring to look for the problem. I've avoided pulling that panel off since the previous owner has clearly had it off in the past and damaged it pretty badly. The Mrs. called around to wrecking yards this week to see if she could find any door panels. No luck, but she did find a yard that still allows pick and pull. They said they don't inventory interior parts but we were welcome to come and look for one. Strange that a company who's slogan is "We Know Our Parts" didn't seem to know if there was a Roadie on the lot. I don't mind, I've been itching to wander a yard anyway. Not too many of those around here anymore. I'm heading over there this morning to prowl around. I haven't figured out for certain if door panels from a sedan are the same as for the estate wagon but I don't see why they wouldn't be, at least for the front doors. Hopefully I'll find a sedan in the yard. If my luck turns out to be really good, maybe even with the same colour interior...maybe even a wagon with the same colour interior...yeah, right.:rolleyes:

    I ordered a set of Monroe Severe Service shocks for the rear from RockAuto. I wind up paying for shipping but I was gonna do that anyway to get the order expedited. I've only got 3 days left on my temporary permit and 8 days before I have to pay that Ministry of the Environment fine so I wanna get the window wiring fixed, the rear window roller installed, the shocks in, and see if I can convince it not to fail the NOX portion of the emissions test within the next few days. No word yet from Napa on the window rollers. Since I was ordering shocks from RockAuto anyway, I threw a couple of rollers in the order. They should be here Monday. I'll see my Dad tomorrow at the annual Santa Claus Parade family gathering. He marches in the colour party for the local Legion so everyone turns out to watch him. He'll give me the scoop on parts then.
     
  4. Cyber-Wizard

    Cyber-Wizard Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I spent 10 years as a Security Installer. We did alarms, access control, video surveillance, home theatre...etc,etc.

    I majored in Electronics/Electricity in high school, with a minor in Digital Electronics. My business partner was a former Broadcast Engineer and one of the other employees was a Radio DJ/Electronics hobbyist (he now teaches Broadcast Technology at the local college). Between the three of us we loved to make stuff. We eventually started an off-shoot company called Electronic Solutions. "You have a problem, we'll solve it with a few circuits". (Not the catchiest of slogans so we only used it amongst ourselves) :). The idea behind that was just to keep our jobs challenging so that we always had to brainstorm and test out new ideas. I miss those days. Sitting behind a desk as an IT manager keeps me out of the trenches a lot.
     
  5. Stormin' Norman

    Stormin' Norman Well-Known Member

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    I was an Electro/Mech tech in the Army, and later owned and ran a TV/Radio and Reupholstery shop in Victoria, BC. When I went back to University, I went into Industrial Engineering and Fortran IV and COBOL programming with the old punchcards and tapes for CNC machines. Just tinker now, but still build my own stuff.
     
  6. Cyber-Wizard

    Cyber-Wizard Well-Known Member

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    Well, no luck at the wrecking yard. All I found was a '91 Roadie Wagon so I couldn't snag the door panels. The interior was a darker shade of blue than mine but I pulled the cargo cover mounting brackets anyway. I found a few pre-'94 Caprice Sedans there as well. One had most of the interior pulled out so I tried following the window switch wiring. Dunno that it helped me much since it was a '93 and the wrong year. A fun trip nonetheless. Since my window lock as well as some of my driver's seat controls are out I'm thinking that the problem must still lie inside the door panel somewhere. Guess I'll just pull the panel off anyway and hope like heck it doesn't fall apart enough that I can't get it back on again.
     
  7. Cyber-Wizard

    Cyber-Wizard Well-Known Member

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    Found it!

    I went outside today and removed the driver's side door panel to dig further into why my window lock button doesn't work. I must have missed something during troubleshooting. I suspected that the wire from the fuse panel was broken and I jumpered power from elsewhere but nothing worked. Today, after I tore apart the door, the frame, pulled up the carpet, opened up the looms and checked on the splice inside the loom...and still didn't find anything. I rang continuity between the front door and the back door again and found it OK. I jumpered the fuse panel wire again and it started working. As I pulled on the fuse panel wire from inside the door panel to make it wiggle to see if I could find it under the dash, the wire came right out of the hinge conduit cut clean as a whistle. I pulled a number of other wires through the conduit but they all looked OK. I'll check on the rest of the wires in the conduit later as some of my power seat functions don't work but I can live without those fixed for now. I just need the windows working to pass the safety inspection. It was getting dark so I packed it in for today. I'll get that wire fix completed tomorrow or Tuesday.

    I was pretty surprised to find what appear to be factory splices inside the wire loom under the carpet. I knew that the one wire coming from the window lock couldn't go to all of the other three doors without being spliced somewhere but I didn't expect it to be inside the wire loom under the carpet.

    I definitely need to find a new drivers side door panel now. It seems that the last person who tried to troubleshoot this had no idea how to get a door panel off and destroyed it. Many pieces fell off in my hand as I took it apart. I guess I'll have to get it put back on to give a semblance of it being fully assembled to have it inspected but it'll be a challenge.
     
  8. Roadking41A

    Roadking41A Well-Known Member

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    I'm glad you found it. Once fixed will all the windows work?
     
  9. Cyber-Wizard

    Cyber-Wizard Well-Known Member

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    Yep. All of the other window switches are wired through the window lock switch on the drivers door. Open that switch and everything shuts off. The wire from that switch to the fuse panel was cut/broken. All I've got to do is splice it and I'm back in business. I'm a happy guy. The wagon has been sitting in the garage since last week because I needed to find this before taking it in to have everything safetied. Now as soon as the new shocks and the roller parts arrive for the back window, I'll be ready to get it on the road. Hopefully the Seafoam will do what I need to pass emissions and I'm home free. I haven't put the Seafoam in yet as I was planning to do that just before I take it in for the test.
     
  10. silverfox

    silverfox New Member

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    Well....not JUST before the test. A couple of days before would be good.
     
  11. wagonmasterIII

    wagonmasterIII New Member

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    I have a 94 RMW and got out my last 5 emissions test reports to see what it's blowing. My original test of my unmodified car was : HC 11.8, CO 0.06, NOX 21.8, at 105,000 miles. Then I programmed out the EGR valve and the smog pump by getting a program from Bryan Herter at PCMforless.com. Totally worth it ! $65 I think. I downloaded it myself, anyway ......... then it blew HC 5.0, CO 0.01, NOX 302. That's with no EGR valve at all. My last 2 test have been creeping higher HC 19, CO 0.14, NOX 607 & 612. Strange that the HC and CO were identical 2 yrs and 40,000 miles apart. The latest test with NOX at 612 (limit is 614 !!) is with 270,000 miles on original cats. So.......... my guess is that maybe it needs the carbon blown out of the combustion chambers. That causes hot spots and will raise the NOX numbers. Fuel injected cars don't have the carbon build up problem typically, but older people drive so slow and such short trips that it's possible there could be some crud in there. Spray a couple of cans of fuel inj/chamber cleaner into the MAF honeycomb screen right where it attaches to the aircleaner box. Try to spray it so that it doesn't hit the heated wire that runs down the center, since cooling it that much will richen the mixture and counteract what you're trying to do. The MAF sensor has to be connected to the air intake pipe for the car to run, so you can't really bypass it in order to spray the cleaner in there. High NOX numbers are a sign of high combustion temperature, so adding ethanol to the fuel would cool down the flame and high octane fuel would cool it down too. Retarding the timing works great to pass the NOX portion of the test, but it's not possible to retard the timing without programming the PCM temporarily. If you have a laptop and go online you can download the software for free I think. You just need to get the cable to hook in from the ALDL connector under the dash to the laptop. Bryan Herter could put together an program just for passing emissions I'd bet. Then you can reload the power tune back in after the test. For starters, I'd try driving it real hard to clean out the crud. Make sure you've got fresh clean oil in it before you do any max power runs. I strongly suggest going onto ImpalaSSforum.com and searching for NOX failures. Those guys have an amazing wealth of knowledge and experience on these cars. Hope all this helps.
     
  12. Cyber-Wizard

    Cyber-Wizard Well-Known Member

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    Since it's not on the road it's not getting run at all other than to pull it in and out of the garage. Should I take it around the block throughout those two days or will it matter if it's just sitting.
     
  13. wagonmasterIII

    wagonmasterIII New Member

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    You need to run it hard to get it cleaned out. Going around the block isn't enough. Really hammer it, keep the thing floored on a hill for 10 seconds at least. Do that a few times and it should be clean. Look in the mirror when you're doing it. You should see brown crud puking out of the exhaust. Or have someone follow you to tell you if there was any junk coming out. The following car is a good blocker for the prying eyes of the police as well.
    Definitely heat it up fully prior to going through emissions as well. Let it idle while you go inside the test facility to sign in.
     
  14. Cyber-Wizard

    Cyber-Wizard Well-Known Member

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    Thanks! A lot of good info there. I've been trolling through the Roadmaster Forum over at BuickForums.com and digging around the 'Net for NOX issues. I'm getting mostly the same stuff, EGR, Thermostat/combustion temperature, and give it a good cleaning. I notice that Phantom309 had a pretty detailed thread on either BuickForums or GMLongRoof about having all the same issues passing NOX with one of his wagons. In the end he took it to a different testing centre and got a pass, not a terribly satisfactory answer.

    Going through the paperwork, it looks like the owner has been playing this game for a while.
    -In 2007 it failed with a NOX of 810(331 is the limit here), two weeks later it failed again with a 501. After replacing the EGR, O2 Sensors, and CATS, it passed at 206
    -In 2009 it failed with a NOX of 394, after replacing the EGR valve it failed with a 968:49:. The EGR was replaced under warranty as defective and it passed with a 237
    -When the previous owner took it in for a test 5 days before I picked it up it blew a 912 on NOX and 0.27 on CO% (Limit is 0.25) but they told me that it had been sitting idle since May.

    I'm thinking that it's very much just a crud buildup issue. The exhaust smell was very noticeable when I backed it into the garage today. It wasn't like that any of the other times I backed it in. part of me hopes that's the PetroCan Tactrol detergent doing it's job. When I bought the car, the drugged out cousin of the seller came out to tell us that the old fella crawled around town in the car and never went over 40Kms/hr. I'm willing to bet that it never got injector cleaner or even decent gas either. I think it really just needs some care and attention. I pulled the EGR and thought it looked OK, but I don't know what it would look like if it weren't OK. As a mechanic, I make a great I.T. guy, so much of this is coming to me very slowly. I took Tuesday and Wednesday off work to finish up on the wagon and have all of the tests done, assuming the window parts and shocks arrive OK. Maybe tomorrow or Monday, I'll go out after dark and cloud up the neighbourhood with Seafoam fumes to get it ready.
     
  15. Cyber-Wizard

    Cyber-Wizard Well-Known Member

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    The kicker there for me is that it can't be on the road yet. That $360 fine that I got last week for driving it without an emissions test pass has made me a little edgy. I don't want them to snag me again. The Ministry of the Environment and the Ministry of Transportation can't get their stories together. MTO says that you need to get a temporary permit in order to drive the vehicle on the road to take it in to get an emissions test. MoE says that you can't drive it on the road with a temporary permit without first getting an emissions test. Dunno who's right, but both will fine you for violating the rules. MoE now also has a hotline and web form to report smoking cars. Anyone can rat you out just by taking down your license plate.
     

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